Gaming on a Plasma

[CorrupT88]

To my eyes the panasonics all flicker a lot... The VT30 seems a bit better but still to flickery for me. On the LG and Samsungs I cannot see barely any flickering.

I like the way LCD are all light and small and the Samsung 6530 is really good... Its just a shame that Samsung ruin this TV by having such bad QC on the backlight uniformity.

[Shocked2]

Sounds like the Samsung was oversaturated and just needed a little toning down of the "color" control, easy fix. My G30 is slightly oversaturated at default as well. The bigger problem is that it scales non-linearly for different colors, which makes it difficult to get red in the right place. If I go for a neutral grayscale, red is oversaturated. If I put red in line with grayscale controls, then grayscale is messed up. If I just use the color control to put red in line, then blue and green end up undersaturated.

It's a shame about the dithering. It's a shame there isn't a perfect TV. Here's hoping OLED will get everything right but I doubt it. For now, I'll just have to go with what's best available, and that's the Panny plasma for me.

Flickering is inherent to plasma. Refresh rate is the only factor afaik and I don't see how one 60hz plasma could flicker more or less than another 60hz plasma. I'm open for explanations for this claim.

Yeah, I think I'm leaning towards sticking with Panny. If I do exchange mine for a smaller model I might also look into the ST50, but the problem is it's pretty new and there doesn't seem to be a ton of information about it.

To my eyes the panasonics all flicker a lot... The VT30 seems a bit better but still to flickery for me. On the LG and Samsungs I cannot see barely any flickering.

I'm assuming they weren't in 48Hz mode? I'm not entirely sure why it's even there - the menu basically even tells you you can use that mode but it's going to flicker a lot.

[valtterieranen]

I've been to stores to compare TV's but it's a terrible environment. I still had no idea how the G30 performed after messing around with it for an hour in the shop. The lighting is wrong, the material is wrong, everything is just wrong. It's not like I could have slapped a PC in there and run a calibration, not to mention it takes days to get the calibration just right.

Every weakness that I saw in the store turned out to be non-issues, like the green push or the dim picture. None of the real weaknesses were apparent in the store, like dithering, color decoding or gamma shortcomings.

Opinions of TV's formed in short times in store environments should be taken with a truckload of salt, even if they're your own.

[Shocked2]

Every weakness that I saw in the store turned out to be non-issues, like the green push or the dim picture. None of the real weaknesses were apparent in the store, like dithering, color decoding or gamma shortcomings.

Funny enough, I'm having the dim picture issue at the moment. Seem unable to find a balance in the brightness level - turning it down makes the blacks better and makes many scenes look a lot better, but many scenes look way to dim and unnaturally dark. Can't really up the brightness much because because it brings out the dithering more and just doesn't look as good in general.

Seems like upping the brightness washes the picture our moreso than actually making it brighter.

[CorrupT88]

Funny enough, I'm having the dim picture issue at the moment. Seem unable to find a balance in the brightness level - turning it down makes the blacks better and makes many scenes look a lot better, but many scenes look way to dim and unnaturally dark. Can't really up the brightness much because because it brings out the dithering more and just doesn't look as good in general.

Seems like upping the brightness washes the picture our moreso than actually making it brighter.

IS that a VT panasonic?

[valtterieranen]

You should be using contrast to increase brightness and leave the actual brightness setting at default to keep black level at bay.

It may also be a gamma issue. Are you using THX mode or..?

Are you outputting a 16-235 or 0-255 signal?

Lastly, you may simply be used to a low gamma figure, or you may be used to displays with high black levels. All the color information is between the lowest black level and the highest brightness level, which would mean that the darkest shades of colors are much brighter on a 0.22cd/m2 display than a 0.02cd/m2 one and the 50% luminance point would be higher as well.

EDIT: Just measured my G30's peak brightness at 138cd/m2 in THX mode, 0 brightness and 60 contrast ( maximum for EU models ).

[Shocked2]

IS that a VT panasonic?

GT30

You should be using contrast to increase brightness and leave the actual brightness setting at default to keep black level at bay.

Right, but I've had the contrast all the way up to 90.

It may also be a gamma issue. Are you using THX mode or..?

Are you outputting a 16-235 or 0-255 signal?

I've been switching between THX mode and some settings I found over at AVS designed for dark rooms that use gamma 2.4.

Outputting 16-235 I think. Mostly blu-ray content, with most TV shows being on hiatus and full-swing baseball season still a few weeks off

Lastly, you may simply be used to a low gamma figure, or you may be used to displays with high black levels. All the color information is between the lowest black level and the highest brightness level, which would mean that the darkest shades of colors are much brighter on a 0.22cd/m2 display than a 0.02cd/m2 one and the 50% luminance point would be higher as well.

My LCD had decent black levels for its age (2007), but not that great by today's standards. The plasma is definitely an improvement, but to a bit more modest degree than I expected.

[valtterieranen]

2.4 is the darkest midtones you can get out of the set. THX mode is around 2.0 gamma.

16-235 is what you'd want. The TV supports 0-255 but doesn't handle it very well.

THX mode on full contrast is probably the most brightness you'll realistically get out of it without going for dynamic modes. If that's not enough then I suppose there's nothing to be done.

[Shocked2]

What I could actually do is exchange it for an ST50. At tad more expensive and I'd lose THX mode but it reportedly has better blacks, color, and brightness (though to what extent remains to be seen I think). But also any unknown issues the 2012 models bring.

I'd be immediately sold if it had reduced noticeable flickering, though. It is getting a little annoying in certain places, but I think I probably just need to get used to it. But based on where I notice it it seems like something that would be annoying if the OP wants to run Windows on it (assuming the Samsungs behave the same way)

[CorrupT88]

I always thought that 16-235 is significantly worse because you are missing 16 shades of black and it will make blacks appear grey? Why are you recommending this over 0-255?!

--- Post Update ---

What I could actually do is exchange it for an ST50. At tad more expensive and I'd lose THX mode but it reportedly has better blacks, color, and brightness (though to what extent remains to be seen I think). But also any unknown issues the 2012 models bring.

I'd be immediately sold if it had reduced noticeable flickering, though. It is getting a little annoying in certain places, but I think I probably just need to get used to it. But based on where I notice it it seems like something that would be annoying if the OP wants to run Windows on it (assuming the Samsungs behave the same way)

To my eyes the Samsung or LG barely flicker at all whereas the Panasonics are horribly flickery... I wish I didnt notice this but for some reason I do. This rules out the Panasonics for me along with the green blobs, dithering etc.